Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH

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ZeroCool

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Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« on: July 05, 2011, 07:52:16 PM »
Is it possible that the AT-1 is an aired EVH EBMM pickup?

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oilpit

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #1 on: July 05, 2011, 08:02:51 PM »
No, not really...

I mean, theoretically, it is possible.  Possible in the most literal definition of the word, for example, it's possible that Elvis is still alive and hiding in a cave in Montana.
While this situation is in fact, possible, the likelihood of it having any sort of correlation with reality is highly unlikely.

It is extremely unfortunate that neither Dimarzio nor EBMM will release the specs on that pickup, because it really was a fantastic sounding set.  However until that day comes (which, knowing Larry, it will not) the simple fact of the matter is that you can't buy the illustrious EVH pickup (new that is).  There are pickups that will get you close (the half aired Tone Zone seems to be the closest pickup to this) but if you want the real deal you'll have to pay top dollar on ebay...

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zenmindbeginner

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #2 on: July 06, 2011, 02:25:04 PM »
I was under the impression that the AT-1 is sort of DiMarzio's "JB with 250K pots" with VV airing.

It might get one in the ballpark, but is essentially designed for Andy Timmons.

There is no way that DiMarzio would have just slapped a AT-1 sticker on the back of a B1 and pronounced it as specially designed for Mr. Timmons.

The coincidence is that they are both insanely good hot rodded PAF style pickups.

The AT-1 is built around Andy's vintage JB with some additional "DiMarzio tweaks" (Andy's JB was supposedly already modded and stopped working when he got the AT-1 designed). It's not a JB clone, but has the same 44AWG wire and A5 magnet... I wouldn't call a Norton or Tone Zone a JB clone and they use the same wire and magnet also.

A JB can sound harsh in a 25 fret guitar, so the AT-1 is absolutely smoother and the air technology gives it a bit more definition and clarity that the JB depends on it's high mid presence to deliver.

Is the JB sort of a starting point for all 44 AWG hot rodded PAF style designs? Absolutely... it's the great grandfather of all hot Alnico bridge pups. The 16-18K sweet spot is just that, a sweet spot for getting the best tone out of 44 AWG winds. 44AWG sort of tonally maxes out after a certain number of turns. It's the type of 44 AWG wire used, how it's wound and the materials used in the design which dictates the actual difference in sound between the various 44 AWG hot rodded models out there.

It's sort of insulting to infer that DiMarzio plays shell games with their pickup designs though isn't it? It's one thing to speculate on how to best achieve the EBMM Axis pickups with DiMarzio's existing product line, but assuming that DiMarzio would repackage an OEM  pickup design and sell it as an artist's signature pickup is maybe going a bit too far.

It's a nice theory but in all likelihood, is erroneous.

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oilpit

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #3 on: July 06, 2011, 02:49:42 PM »
What exactly do you mean by calling all these pickups "hot rodded PAFs"?

The JB is about as far away from a PAF as you can get, thin wire, even windings, high DCr etc.  The AT-1 is even more different due to the Dimarzio technologies (airing, VV).

One final thing, what do you mean by saying a JB can sound harsh in a 25 fret guitar (I'm assuming that you meant 24).  Not only does Andy not play a 24 fret guitar, but the extra frets would only affect the neck pickup, where the JB is rarely if ever used.

Not trying to call you out or say you are wrong, just trying to clarify...

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zenmindbeginner

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #4 on: July 06, 2011, 04:50:24 PM »
What exactly do you mean by calling all these pickups "hot rodded PAFs"?

It's just a slang term that I personally use.

The JB is about as far away from a PAF as you can get, thin wire, even windings, high DCr etc.  The AT-1 is even more different due to the Dimarzio technologies (airing, VV).

I have a bad habit of seeing the PAF roots of many modern humbuckers.... I see active pups, PAF style humbuckers, Filtertrons, FWRH, single coils and stacked single buckers as definitive categories. Bill Lawrence low inductance designs are quite unique and are a category onto themselves and I don't have much experience with Bartolinis or DeArmonds (outside of one that was on my 12 string as a young teenager).

Categorizing things has always been one of my strengths and weaknesses. lol.

One final thing, what do you mean by saying a JB can sound harsh in a 25 fret guitar (I'm assuming that you meant 24).  Not only does Andy not play a 24 fret guitar, but the extra frets would only affect the neck pickup, where the JB is rarely if ever used.

I've always found that shorter scale lengths have a sort of warmer sound and the longer scale lengths can have more edge and cut, that's sort of where I was going... but I clearly meant 25" not 25 frets. lolz.

I was up all night editing video and typed the post right before I caught a long overdue cat nap. I'll change the frets to inches.

I've found that the JB's edge and cut is a bit subdued in shorter scale lengths and the harsh upper mids on the unwound strings aren't really ever an issue like they are on 25" scale lengths. I dunno... it's just my experience.

I'm a JB nut and if the pickup was a woman, I would have married her already! I've got JB2s, Bugseybuckers, JBJs, custom shop double creams and just picked up a 35th Anniversary commemorative JB and a liberator... if I ever get ahead of work, i'd like to do some back to back tone tests.

It was love/hate and I HATED the JB for many years and avoided them like the plague. I became a believer after picking up a really cheap guitar that happened to have a JB in it despite my misconceptions and misguided notions.

It took me a couple of years of working on my picking technique... basically refining it and paying extra attention to the way that I hold angle my pick. It wasn't until I moved to an angled pick attack for most of my picking on the unwound strings that I started to understand the mojo of the JB.

Not trying to call you out or say you are wrong, just trying to clarify...
I needed that Oilpit! Thanks!  ;D

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oilpit

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #5 on: July 06, 2011, 08:06:44 PM »
I totally get that, and it actually is a pretty good slang term to use, it's a good way of differentiating standard slug/screw buckers with the vast majority of other kinds of pickup!

And good to know that you are a fellow JB nut.  They basically are the best pickups ever made IMO, they just sound perfect! 

Again, I hope I didn't come off as rude or condescending because that's definitely not what I want!

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zenmindbeginner

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #6 on: July 06, 2011, 10:52:15 PM »
I totally get that, and it actually is a pretty good slang term to use, it's a good way of differentiating standard slug/screw buckers with the vast majority of other kinds of pickup!

And good to know that you are a fellow JB nut.  They basically are the best pickups ever made IMO, they just sound perfect! 

Again, I hope I didn't come off as rude or condescending because that's definitely not what I want!

I read your posts and learn from you Oilpit, you are a high priest of tone in my book. You are as polite as you are knowledgeable and could never come off as rude or condescending IMHO.

iVive El Oilpit!


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oilpit

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2011, 06:25:28 AM »
Stop it you're gonna make me blush  ;D

I truly appreciate your kind words, karma for being a great source of knowledge and a pleasure to deal with (and for fully appreciating the JB...it's totally underrated around here)

And well done with the Beck picture, you're all over the place!
I should probably go about making that my avatar over here as well...

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Offline Marshall Law

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #8 on: July 09, 2011, 07:36:27 PM »
Both use awg 44 poly wire wound to approx. 8.5K per coil, have a alnico 5 magnet and are machine wound.
The AT-1 has the airbucker patent /design and VV Patent/design while the axis does not use either. so dimarzio is not pulling any tricks or stunts since both in stock form ARE NOT the same pu. the rest is up you , from my own experience when i made the AT-1 no longer have air  gaps(i used parts from a old tone zone, and removed the two screws under the bobbin to get rid of the VV design, they sound the same! and yes I own 3 axis sets i have bought from ebay and elsewhere to compare.  :madness:  Many dont realize it but the axis is very close to a JB. so the AT-1 fits the bill.
FWIW the air norton is more than close enough to the neck axis,but if you want it even closer de-air the slug coil or just use the liquifire with is a warmer /hotter air norton with hex poles
« Last Edit: July 16, 2011, 08:52:26 PM by buddroyce »

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Offline nitro

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #9 on: July 10, 2011, 03:13:03 PM »
Steve Blucher of Dimarzio explained to me that when Dimarzio got the contract to make the pickup for the Ernie Ball EVH guitar,the pickup that they took out of the Franky at that time was a Duncan JB,thats the pickup that they used to make the Ernie Ball EVH pickup.

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oilpit

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #10 on: July 10, 2011, 03:14:56 PM »
Oh dear jesus not again...

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Offline nitro

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #11 on: July 10, 2011, 03:18:39 PM »
Oilpit, you need some serious help man you are already starting with your insults and BS,you should be banned from ever sight you belong to,you cause many problems for sight members.

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Luijo

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #12 on: July 10, 2011, 03:29:55 PM »
I didn't see any insult(s) in Oilpit's comment...or any BS!  ???

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Offline nitro

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #13 on: July 10, 2011, 03:38:45 PM »
Luijo then what did olipit mean.

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Luijo

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Re: Dimarzio AT-1 for EVH
« Reply #14 on: July 10, 2011, 03:40:57 PM »
That a can of worms is about to be opened again...isn't that what you mean Oilpit?